How Far?

For all the talk of – well, what you’ll read here – I don’t remember ever hearing it as a teenager. But here it is, irrefutable evidence, that this has been part of our culture for fifty years, at least.

From the Improvement Era, July 1963 –

How Far?

By Millie Cheesman

“But you have to permit certain things, Julie, if you want to be popular!”

Sandra Burke was a very close school friend. She surprised Julie by continuing, “You can’t be an old fuddy-duddy and expect the boys to keep on dating you.”

“Well, Sandy,” Julie returned, “any boy that treats me that way can just find himself another girl, that’s all.” The girls turned into Julie’s front yard.

“Oh, sometimes I’ve wondered,” mused Sandra, “if it would be the right thing, but I don’t want to sit home every weekend. I want to have fun. Besides, what could be wrong with a little hugging and kissing and . . . well, you know, Julie, I’d never do anything really wrong!”

Julie’s eyes widened at these remarks as they both sat down by the lily pond. Sandra flushed a little, “Boy, what are you saving yourself for? You’ll end up being an old maid, that’s what! Not me; no, sir. My mother and dad have never told me it was wrong to pet. I’ve wondered about it a little, but it seems to be the thing to do, and I don’t want anything to interfere with my popularity. You’re so straightlaced, Julie. Are all you Mormons like that?”

“Well, why don’t you come to Mutual with me tonight and find out for yourself! I’ve told you how much fun we have there, and you’ll see that we’re not as stiff as you think!”

Sandra looked at Julie in disgust. “Oh, come on. Why don’t you go skating with me tonight? Why do you always have to go to Mutual all the time?”

Julie smiled, “Well, our dance instructor is going to teach us a new way to do the Cha-cha. I don’t wan’t to miss that! If you come tonight you’d be in my Laurel class. You’d never believe that our teacher, Doris Hansen, is the mother of four boys. She’s so pretty and lots of fun! She’s always doing something nice for us girls, and I’ll bet you anything she could set you straight on dating conduct!”

Sandra tilted her head to one side thoughtfully. Then, “All right, just for that I’ll come!”

They both laughed as Julie ran her hand through the water in the lily pond; she made a mental note that she must call her Laurel teacher, Doris Hansen, and tell her about the nonmember she was bringing to Mutual tonight.

Doris was asking herself just how far she was expected to go in order to demonstrate her devotion to the Lord and to his Church. Sometimes she felt that along with her responsibilities at home, husband Frank in the bishopric, plus the new baby, that her newly assigned work as Laurel teacher was almost more than she could manage. The lessons were such a challenge, and there were so few girls of Laurel age in the ward. It hardly seemed worth all the hours of preparation each week. The girls, though sweet and lively, were very independent and often acted as if they couldn’t care less whether Doris did or didn’t come each Tuesday with her special material that required so much preparation. Doris felt, at times, that too much was expected of women in the Church, and she, for one, was going to ask about the possibility of a release! Her four children required so much time, and there were any number of other women who could take the class and do a much better job.

All these thoughts were running through her mind as she plunged her breakfast dishes into the hot, sudsy water. The washing machine was droning through its cycle as it washed the baby’s clothes, and Doris began to think about her class and the lesson that was to be given this evening on chastity. It was a touchy subject, and although she had read in several books and studied articles by Church leaders, she was still wondering how she could approach the subject without trying to appear disgustingly self-righteous! She wanted, in some way, to give the girls the desire to keep themselves clean. She wanted to inspire them, but how would she approach them? She felt so inadequate and such a miserable failure!

Suddenly the washing machine began to spit suds all over the kitchen floor. She flew to the garage for the mop and caught the soapy water just before it soaked into the living room rug. No sooner had she finished mopping up the wash-water than the telephone rang. Her ten-year-old son, Charlie, had fallen on his hand while trying to catch a flyball.

They thought his wrist was broken! Could she come right up and take him to have it X-rayed? Doris swooped the baby from the play-pen and dashed to the school. As she headed for the doctor’s office with her injured son she wondered when she was going to have time to organize her thoughts for her class. So many other problems were whirling around in her head. Thank goodness the results of the X-rays only indicated a bad sprain.

Upon arriving home, Doris hurriedly hung up her baby’s washing and finished the dishes. She began mixing a double batch of cookies to take to her Mutual class. Again the ringing telephone interrupted her thoughts. It was Julie Martin to tell her about the nonmember she was bringing to Mutual that night. Julie said she hoped Doris could come up with some answers to change Sandra’s ideas on personal standards and dating popularity.

Doris’s head was spinning. Today, as every day, had been a regular three-ring circus with the boys. What would she have to offer the girls in her class in the way of advice and counsel tonight? What good did all those books and articles do her if she couldn’t collect her thoughts? She informed the boys that she was going to her room for a few minutes, and they were not to bother her. She sat down at her desk, rested her head in her arms, and began to pray. “Heavenly Father, I feel so weak and in need of inspiration. Please help me in my calling as’ a teacher. So much depends on me this evening. Give me the words to say that will touch the hearts of these girls, and especially the one who will not be of our faith. Forgive me my many weaknesses and give me the strength and ability to do the things that are required of me both in my home and at Church, for one would be nothing without the other.”

Two of the boys suddenly burst into the bedroom. The younger claimed that Charlie had taken his gum, and he wanted it back! Charlie looked at his younger brother in disbelief, “You mean you want it even after I chewed it?”

They all laughed, and the boys broke into a run as they heard their father’s car in the driveway. Doris greeted Frank with a big hug and kiss. She knew, at last, what she would say to her girls that evening and began to enjoy a feeling of calm relief.

# # # # #

“Hi, Sister Hansen!” The girls came into the classroom chattering and laughing. Most of the talk was about school, new dresses, and the dance this coming Friday.

“Sister Hansen, this is my girl friend, Sandra Burke, from school. She wanted to visit Mutual with me tonight!” The girls exchanged happy glances.

“Why, we’re so happy to have you with us, Sandra.”

Roll was taken; Julie introduced Sandra to the rest of the class; and then Doris stood up.

“Girls, our lesson tonight is on chastity.” Doris paused, and without another word she picked up her purse and brought out a package of gum. The girls exchanged curious glances. Doris stood silently as she unwrapped the gum, put it in her mouth and began to chew. She chewed a few seconds, then took the gum out of her mouth, dropped it on the floor, picked it up, rolled it in the palm of her hand, then passed it all around the class for each girl to examine. By this time they were about to burst with curiosity! When the gum was returned to Doris, she spoke for the first time in several minutes, “Girls, I’d like you each to have some gum, too. Julie, would you take this piece that we have just passed around?”

Julie spoke up quickly, “Oh, I don’t want that dirty piece! I want one that hasn’t been touched!”

Doris continued, “Julie, that is exactly the way young men feel about girls they marry! They feel just as you did about the gum. You wanted some that had never been touched. What a sad moment it could be in your life, girls, when you meet the man of your dreams, to find out that you might not be worthy of him, nor fine enough for him, because you wanted popularity at any price when you were younger! The price is too dear. Some of you girls in class tonight may be wondering just how far you should go when you date the boys and still be popular in the right way.

“I recently talked with a college boy on this very subject, and do you know what he said? He remarked that it is the girl who sets the mood for the evening! Both in her dress and in her actions. By these two things a fellow gains or loses respect for a girl. You can never go wrong by being genuinely interested in the boy’s opinions. Find out about his likes and dislikes and, mainly, just be your own happy self. He will come back again and again if he is the kind of young man who is worth caring about.

“I talked with another college boy recently, who dated many, many girls at the university, and he said that one of the dates he remembers best was with a girl who wouldn’t let him kiss her! They went on a hike and spent the evening in wonderful conversation and laughter. And, what was his opinion of this young lady? He said, ‘You know, even though she refused to kiss me, I had one of the best times I can remember, and I really respected that girl!’ It might surprise you to know that some fellows are merely testing you when they ask for an evening of kissing.

“I do hope you girls will decide tonight you don’t want to be passed around from boy to boy and become an easy girl that nobody wants. So, whenever you chew a piece of gum, please think of this little lesson tonight. You girls are all so dear to me, and I want each of you to marry the finest man in the world! How far will you go? Why, you want to go on for eternity with the man of your dreams! Don’t be forced to take second best because of mistakes you made when you were as young as you are now!”

You could have heard a pin drop in that classroom. Even after refreshments, the girls were a little more reserved than usual as they left for their dancing activity. It was hard to tell exactly how each felt about these deeply serious matters.

Upon her return home that evening Doris reviewed in her thoughts everything she had said and done in class. Teaching those girls was such a responsibility! Perhaps she wasn’t the one to do it! Perhaps her approach was completely wrong! She would call the bishop tomorrow morning and ask to be replaced.

Tomorrow morning came very early for Doris, for she had slept fitfully. The children were still asleep as she opened the front door to get the morning paper. An envelope fluttered to the floor. The name, “Mrs. Hansen,” was written boldly across the front. Doris was puzzled. Who in the world would be writing her in the middle of the night? She opened the letter and began to read:

“Dear Mrs. Hansen: It’s hard to say the things I feel, so I’ll try to write and tell you how much your class meant to me tonight. I only wish every girl I know could have heard what I heard from your lips. Julie doesn’t know how lucky she is to be able to belong to a church that helps her with her problems. I realize that a lot is depending on me now when I date. I will never forget the lesson I learned in your class. Could I come to Mutual from now on, even though I am not a member of your Church? I would, like to hear more about having a husband for eternity. That is something I have never heard before, and it is a beautiful thought. I will always be grateful to Julie. I would never have attended Church with her if she hadn’t spoken so proudly of all the things she does there! I am glad that Julie has influenced me, instead of my influencing her to do things, because my ideas wouldn’t have helped either one of us! I don’t know whether I am saying these things very well. I just want to thank you for telling me the things that my own Mother should have told me long ago! Sincerely, Sandra Burke.”

Doris was crying. She knew now how far she was expected to go! She must do her best with these wonderful girls. Though it seemed discouraging and unrewarding at times, if she could only help one girl, it was worth all the effort. As for asking for a release— the ward had enough problems!

Cite Keepa

Regrettably, meanies have stolen content from Keepa in the past! I'm confident you will choose honesty and cite this page like this:

MLA: Parshall, Ardis E. "How Far?." Keepapitchin.org, 08 Nov 2017, https://keepapitchinin.org/2017/11/08/how-far/.

APA: Parshall, A. (2017, Nov 08). How Far?. Keepapitchinin.org. https://keepapitchinin.org/2017/11/08/how-far/

HTML: <a target="_new" href="https://keepapitchinin.org/2017/11/08/how-far/">How Far?</a>

12 thoughts on “How Far?”

  1. Well my goodness. This is one I never heard growing up (and believe me, I heard a lot of weirdo stuff; my hometown is kinda loopy and my seminary teachers seemed to specialize in FPRs).

  2. I never heard it either, Jean, and thought it was a new thing because so many women younger than me (including Elizabeth Smart) refer to it. But no, it goes way back.

  3. What I see in the story: a young women’s leader trying to help the young women in her charge. I’m okay with that.

  4. Ugh. Good effort. Bad follow through. It makes me wonder about how sometimes we say ‘well it’s the thought that counts.’ Because in this case there was sincere thought. The thoughts were just wrong. How many of us sincerely care about those under our care but fumble about and teach things just plain….wrong? We really need to teach morality, virtue and chasity better. Understand the true doctrine behind it. So glad that this wasn’t taught in my YW. Thanks for posting Ardis.

  5. I don’t think I ever heard the ‘gum analogy’ at church. But I do remember a failed version of the ‘cookie analogy.’ The teacher passed around a plate of cookies. Then she tried to point out that nobody wanted the cookie that already had a bite out of it. But she couldn’t find that cookie on the plate. One of the other leaders admitted that she had eaten it, thinking that a smaller, broken cookie would better fit her diet.

    I’m also wondering what analogy was presented to the Young Men. “Sons, no woman wants a dirty athletic sock. You must be clean.” Hmmm. Somehow I don’t think so.

  6. This is so gross–I hate that we still, in some ways, treat girls like they are commodities to be used up. I’m currently reading David Copperfield, and looking at the characters and story through a feminist lens is pretty horrifying. Things are getting better, thank goodness.

    On a lighter note, I would really, really like to read a gender-swapped version of this story.

  7. I remember some really weird presentation from our Scoutmaster when I was a Deacon about dressing modestly as a boy and not having torn-up old Levi cutoffs that, well, he got very uncomfortable at this point and whatever else he said didn’t make much sense.

    He also said that girls like boys who are successes and can afford nice cars so we should work hard, etc. I didn’t really follow that one too well either.

  8. I heard variations on this, plus the nail in the board analogy in seminary back in the 60s, and it always bothered me. Plus I have never liked chewing gum in the first place, so there is that.

    “He remarked that it is the girl who sets the mood for the evening! Both in her dress and in her actions.”

    It was all the girl’s responsibility, apparently, and apart from the nail in the board analogy, I never heard anything like this on the boy’s side.

    What I did learn on the boy’s side was how to stalk someone else in the woods and not get seen (Boy Scout Field Manual), how to shoot a gun accurately and safely (courtesy of the NRA), and that you could get arrested for shoplifting p0rn and still be scoutmaster, one of the highlights of my youth. After scouts, then it was basketball until I graduated from high school.

    I am sure that I am forgetting some things, but it says something that these are the memories I have of my personal experience in the Church’s youth programs. I do have a few memories of road shows, though, which definitely appear to be a historical artifact.

  9. Well, she was correct in her premise. There are men who do not want a used girl. I’ve met a bunch. But the point of the lesson should be that those are NOT the ones we try to attract.

Comments are closed.